Player poll: Prefered solutions to the density problem?

[Stormseeker]

It's hard for me to understand why those that would "go down with the ship" choose to...when the server and their pc will be lost in half a year anyway.
Are yall the ones that log in to scheduled campaigns and no other time?

[Nyarlathotep]

Ultimately shutting down little used servers will not have all that much an effect on player density, if no one is playing on a server already shutting it down won't actually be shifting any of the active population. If you want to increase density you need to shut down active popular servers and force their players to congregate elsewhere. Shutting down empty servers will make gamespy look neater but won't have to great of an effect on density.

The otherside of course is that for the most part players are segragting themselves, for whatever reasons players are not congregating. My guess is that there is likley some reasons behinds this behavior pattern and that while everyone wants to see numbers go up and have more players around they have not been willing to go to servers that are more active. If players don't want to make that choice on their own I don't necessarily think forcing them will be that effective.

[Twiggy]

It's hard for me to understand why those that would "go down with the ship" choose to...when the server and their pc will be lost in half a year anyway.
Are yall the ones that log in to scheduled campaigns and no other time?

With my PC, it was really was so entirely OOC to move my PC when the mod went down there was no option but to retire her. Smoothing it over with some half-ass excuse for moving was worse than retirement. Depends on how IC someone wants to stay.

[Keith Mac]

Once the server's Live, it should stay Live unless the HDM wants to take it down

I agree with most everything shady wrote except this....I think my proposal however extreme will at least allow "truly dead" servers to be put to the wayside until they get there act together....again like this

A Server that has either not been logged into by a Player or DM for a period of one month be deemed "dead" and put back to beta...

Servers be monitered to make sure they conform to a structured list of rules/criteria to either make live or keep their live status....

Allow a portal from every server to every server by magical means if Necc., regardless of whether or not it follows canon....(We alter canon after the first day of live anyways and it would open up travel possibilities to enhance ENJOYMENT for many)....Example: Arabel City Magic shop would offer teleportation as a service for a agreed upon amount of GP.........Example: Ship from TPI combines with caravan to bring you to the Frozen North with one Scripted Conversation...

And also make a clear stickied thread for each server where each Player/DM can post only once(And edit/delete as neccessary) with there Play times and styles.....

I am curious if there are any downsides to this proposal...We can't make it easy for someones server to be cut...It just would not help anything at all....We can make it so that each server has a criteria(To Be Determined) to meeet that is more then reasonable.......I would be happy to work with a team to make this criteria and even test each server for implementation....(Unless it requires any tech skillset)

[Swift]

It's hard for me to understand why those that would "go down with the ship" choose to...when the server and their pc will be lost in half a year anyway.
Are yall the ones that log in to scheduled campaigns and no other time?

If NC were to ever go down, my PC would go down with it, simply because she is so tightly tied to NC and AC that there is no reason she would abandon Cormyr and its leaders and set up base elsewhere. The rulers of Cormyr would effectivly have to banish her to make her leave

[fluffmonster]

It's hard for me to understand why those that would "go down with the ship" choose to...when the server and their pc will be lost in half a year anyway.
Are yall the ones that log in to scheduled campaigns and no other time?

If NC were to ever go down, my PC would go down with it, simply because she is so tightly tied to NC and AC that there is no reason she would abandon Cormyr and its leaders and set up base elsewhere. The rulers of Cormyr would effectivly have to banish her to make her leave

That's not a problem. If NC were to go down, you just decide for yourself that your PC got banished. Snap, done. Don't even need a DM for it, be your own DM for the occasion. The real question is whether you'd still *want* to play the PC if it wasn't on NC, not whether you could.

[Dorn]

Or ask a DM of a new server to establish a Cormyran mission/embassy in a new place and have emela sent to be Cormyrs royal voice in West Faerun, no small task for no stock standard representative.

Plenty of excuses that could be used even at that level of involvement.

I don't know the intracacies of twigs PCs situation, but i know there are super-druids on other servers (ie the level 367 one on TLR who is one of the preeminate druids in Faerun) that may hear 'through the earth and birds' of one that walks far away but with such power that he may call them for some specific purpose.

While i 110% respect players saying its too IC to move them. We must remember this is a game for our enjoyment and act accordingly. It's always an individual choice however.

[Twiggy]

Very little beyond a mandate from her god would have moved my PC at the time I had to retire her. That excuse had already been used with a previous forced move. There comes a time when all the excuses you can muster become corny and erode the depth of the character, at least to me. I played that PC too long and put too much effort into her for that to happen. Wouldn't be so much an issue these days as so much time has passed but the people she was connected to are gone so there would be little point in bringing her back.

[Dorn]

Just using it as an example twigs...not necessarily applicable as i dunno what your situ was.

[Twiggy]

Its a good example....just for the 'cannot be moved' side of the issue.

[AcadiusLost]

The entire "drop servers to gain density" argument really does seem like Gamespy Listing Panic to me. There may be some PC, like Fluff's, who don't mind moving, and will congregate at more busy servers. But those PCs will likely move anyway in that case. For the people who have factions, PC housing, temples they own/tend, shrines they've built, families to look after- these are all situations that do not lend to easy "IC excuse" server moves.

And how would it help DM numbers? Each server has it's own style, some have personality clashes with others. Some folks are restricted in where they want to DM due to where their PCs have reason to travel. On NC/AC, we tend to build unanimous approval on new DMs before instating them- certainly no guarantee we would accept all "refugee" DMs- but even by definition, why would there be "refugee" DMs if the servers being cut were "dead"?

I'm sorry, the idea of instatravel to the latest big DM quest is abhorrant to me. One of the major reasons I play ALFA is for the level of immursion, and the excellent standard of IC RP I've had with other players. I've had some enjoyable DM quests certainly, but I've also found my interations with other PCs to be the highlight of the experience. As a DM, I've always seen it as a responsibility to try to bring PCs together in a believable and meaningful manner- and offer stories or encounters that make sense for their character concept. I'm not into calculating intense combat challenges, nor do I want a pile of attention-starved players (who can't be arsed to log on without a DM) parachuting into the quests I run. DM'ing is a labor of love- adding additional burden like making the DM OOC beat off extra players from a quest in which their participation doesn't make sense is... well it sure doesn't encourage me to DM.

And for the people who complain about no one being on, and explain that they can't be arsed to log on themselves? What do you think the rest of your server is doing? More than likely they're taking a passing glimpse at the listings, and feeling the same. I say log in anyway- it's what I've been doing for a long time, and it works. Assuming you don't have a PC that other players don't want to talk to- suddenly you're giving folks a reason to log in.

I've also sat on empty servers on the DM client. Contrary to common belief, having one, two, even three DMs on, does not automatically make a server populated. And if you think sitting on a server without other players is dull, try sitting on a server with the DM client alone for three hours- it's a lot worse. Players at least have things to do- each PC has a daily routine, history, desires, interests- plenty to emote and RP your way through while you wait. But as a DM I want to DM people who are willing to play, not folks who are going to jump server the moment I log off, or who can't be bothered to log on without a guarantee that they're going to be DMed. It's the wrong attitude IMHO.

It's also another reason I like the RP XP scripts- gives players another incentive to log in and stay logged in, which gives the DMs in turn a reason to come DM.

[Ronan]

So if your server was shut down, would you create a new PC, since s/he cannot travel ICly?

I always think this argument is SOOO extremist sorry mate

NOONE would begrudge peopel moving server if one was closed down. This is a game afterall. Inventing an IC reason or something for a one off switch (ie not every day). It is always easy to come up with a reason...even if it invlves speaking to the DMs on the new server and asking for a hook to justify it. People did it when DD was down all those years ago and moved to SD. Peopl do it all the time when tehre are prolonged down times.

I think this argument falls into the alfa black and white attitude...rather than realising the world is made up of differing shades of grey.

It wasn't an argument, I was attempted to understand why Mulu was speaking about leaving ALFA when his PC was able to travel. And its not so extremist really, I've seen a lot of PCs retired because their server died. SD and DD are about, what, 50 miles apart? Its much less of a stretch than many places. Extremist or not, its not terribly uncommon. PCs with family, children, temples, sworn sacred oaths to Helm, etc.

[Stormseeker]

Hmm now when you bring in pc's that have so much invested i can understand, plus i forget that there is people here who bring real life issues into the game world. For me it had nothing to do with gamespy...i just though of the times when there is 12 people on ten server's...and if the server numbers was decreased that increased the chances of those same people meeting up together. Simple solution to a complex problem.*grins*

[Mulu]

My PC has traveled most of ALFA in her time; she's only recently settled down. Rerolling rather than moving would be rather dumb unless you were done with the PC. If TPI were selected to be shut down, I'd sell my ship and move, which would be IC. Taking a magic portal for a social trip if affordable would be IC too for that matter.

However, TPI is one of the few "active" servers left, so I doubt it's going to be an issue.

I'm a bit confused. Your PC was willing to travel, but you almost left ALFA because you were on a dead server?

You're not confused, you're just arguing against change. I almost left ALFA because *all* servers are mostly dead, most of the time.

So you were willing to move from the server, but you wanted other servers to be shut down so that other people moved to you?

There's nowhere to move! *All* of ALFA is inactive, some are a lot more inactive than others. I'd like to see ALFA become a place where you can find players and DM's most of the time. Now, currently that would be possible in two ways:

1. Kill half the servers, or more.
2. Allow interserver travel to occur at log in, so you can log in to whatever server is active at that time.

Instead, our "solution" is to tell people to schedule their playtime to a server that is active during that time, but of course not all of us are scheduled players. Some of us are opportunists, we play when we can. In the meantime, we are experiencing player and DM attrition due to inactivity. Holding on to an ideal of representing Faerun in whole, and making interserver travel hard, at a time when the game is aging towards decrepancy and the player and DM base is small is putting form over substance. Are we here to play a game together, or stick to a paradigm that causes the servers to be idle most of the time? I'd rather have more gaming fun than arrogantly stick to a "travel hard, many servers" principle that is causing premature death. Especially given that we are purposefully reducing density for NWN2, so we obviously "get it."

[Ronan]

You're not confused, you're just arguing against change. I almost left ALFA because *all* servers are mostly dead, most of the time.

Ah, I misread you. I took this line "I don't because there is nobody to play with on my current server of choice" to mean that you thought you could get play time elsewhere. I didn't realize you were saying all ALFA servers were too inactive for you. Do you know of a campaign-oriented NWN world more active than ALFA? In other words, worlds where most player activities are based off of DMs?

I suppose I am arguing against a specific type of change (the type that would make my play, or at least DMing, style impossible in ALFA). As I see it, most of this "easy-travel" stuff is just a reaction to the anti-travel opinions which popped up around the time Khondar was getting banned, but the lower player and DM numbers now just multiply things further. Compounding that is the older, more deep-routed reaction to static wealth and farming. ALFA has removed a lot of its static content, or doesn't place any to begin with, because of PGing concerns. Combine that with difficult travel, and you've got a bunch of players who don't bother to log in much unless there is a DM on on their home server, because there really isn't much else to do.

Other PWs have much more extensive static content. Crafting, spawns, whatever, people have things to do without DMs. If a DM logs on to a server where 10 PCs are hapily crafting/PGing/whatever away, he isn't flooded by requests or party-chat. But if a DM logs in to a server with 10 PCs on it who are just sitting around waiting for something to do, then his job suddenly because a lot tougher. The later is more common in ALFA because ALFA isn't a persistant world at all, its campaign world. And I don't think comparing it to other PWs in terms of density is worthwhile, since I don't think campaign worlds are ever going to maintain the sort of player-numbers as PWs will. If ALFA wants to be a PW, its either going to need a lot more static content, or persistant DMs (which even the OAS, in all its denseness, doesn't have). But as long as I've been here, there has been a slow shift towards a more campaign-oriented world (for good or ill).

I could always shut down BG, as a test. I need the box for other things anyways. But what would it accomplish? The only DM who would continue DMing elsewhere would probably be HEEGZ. Would that be worth it?