Alternative traveling

[Veilan]

The problem with this, of course, is that there's no guarantee that your chosen "destination" from yesterday will be the RP hotspot of today... could be you'll log in and appear at Silverymoon only to hear that everyone's back in Rivermoot again. Would that be an acceptable compromise though? Seems like it's the easiest to reconcile IC, allows some mobility for those who feel "trapped" in a given area, but doesn't provide on-demand teleportation services.

Thoughts?

Hence why I suggested doing it the other way around - everytime you "reset" your spells, you reset your "travel token" too. So... if you use it up at the beginning of your session to hook up with your friends, you won't be able to zip back at the end of it.

We can still tweak the reach of each reset and the frequency used if, say, we put it on the same cooldown as the inter-server travel - with the added benefit of not being able to travel from BG to Rivermoot to Silverymoon within the same 5 minutes.

Cheers,

[lakhena]

I'd love to see a caravan/choose-your-current-location-upon-login option... As a newbie/lowbie, I find it disheartening to not be able to find other pcs. (We'll ignore the fact that my pcs walk in circles b/c I still don't know my way around Silverymoon.)

Maybe I'm not as hardcore as everyone else, but I'd rather choose to break immersion if it means I can rp with other people, rather than wander all immersed and lonely by myself.

[Keryn]

Well Veilan im not sure I get what you mean. But if you reset it with resting once you log in you have it ready to be used. You can travel somewhere and rest, and travel back.

But wouldn't it be easier to attached this to the script that already refills your spells and HP and considers your time out of game was enough to recover fully etc?

This way when you log back with a fresh PC (spells and HPs at max) you also have the ability to use the caravans once. Until it resets again, within 1 IG days for example (which is around what? 4 hours?).

its would be a fair compromise, and wouldn't give you the ability to move from Rivermmot To Felbar, but maybe from Rivermoot to SilveryMoon, or from Silverymoon to Felbar.


I think these two routes would suffice, the rest is wilds anyway... with exception maybe of Setlestone but with the difficult terrain wouldn't be admired there were no regular caravans there.

On other hand.. I don't think logging and being able to pick where you start is a good thing... I can see this leading to all sorts of abuses.

Most people meet around Silvy or RM, and HighHold is in the middle sort of a short trip.

So if you have the ability to log in at silvy and move to rivermoot, you would be ok i suppose.

[Veilan]

Yes, that's what I suggested. That it either resets with the log-out restoration for time spent offline, or gets tied to the 24 hour portal restriction (if those two aren't linked already anyway).

This option then should only be redeemable with set routes that make IC sense.

Thus, we would have two sliders to tweak: Cooldown time, and possible routes.

Cheers,

[AcadiusLost]

Wendover Crypts. I've had PCs killed there, and I know a great many others that have also, often being paralysed by a ghoul before its even finished loading up - Not fun and pretty harsh!

Definitely needs looking into, then. Normally the ACR, AT scripts, and spawn system ALL collaborate to prevent any case of a PC appearing right next to a hostile spawn unless they've been forewarned and confirmed that they really do want to AT into trouble. It's possible with all the special systems involved in the travel map encounter that one or more of these protections is not being implemented, but if not, it should be.

Hence why I suggested doing it the other way around - everytime you "reset" your spells, you reset your "travel token" too. So... if you use it up at the beginning of your session to hook up with your friends, you won't be able to zip back at the end of it.

And I still feel the "I want to go to (destination X) right now, and it's OK because I've not jumped instantly to a new location lately" is going too far- too much OOC for my taste. Making arrangements to be moved while you're offline sits much easier with me than spur-of-the moment jumping justified by ret-conning that you really wanted to / already did travel there last time etc. I'm fine with a DM porting in such circumstances, but less so with it being an unsupervised free-for-all.

An intermediate (though somewhat difficult to implement) possibility would allow for players to arrange for offline travel between hubs via the ALFA website, before actually logging in... that would dampen the undesirable side of instant transport. Would require some "Character Management" page setup for the website (which isn't my area at all), but might well be doable by Hialmar and company. I could certainly script the nwscript side of it, though. Could be integrated with a panel to let people clean up their own vault folders, mark PCs as retired, etc, once we have the new vault system up and running. Neat integration and gives players more reason to visit the website.

[Keryn]

Yes, that's what I suggested. That it either resets with the log-out restoration for time spent offline, or gets tied to the 24 hour portal restriction (if those two aren't linked already anyway).

This option then should only be redeemable with set routes that make IC sense.

Thus, we would have two sliders to tweak: Cooldown time, and possible routes.

Cheers,

+1 then my bad didn't got what you were saying.

[Veilan]

I can certainly understand the reservations about immersion and possible weirdness (and exploits) arising. I guess anything we can implement without hassle that doesn't impinge on immersion too badly is welcome though, as we do have trouble with player concentration currently.

I've personally not found travel on TSM to be a hassle (can't speak about BG) - but then again, I started out when I still reliably had people to travel around with.

Cheers,

[t-ice]

If the main roads really are supposed to be safe, then there is the rather obvious alternative to really and truly make them safe. No (hostile) random encounters. None. Not "Hostile random encounters where you can turn around, flee, and then keep going as if nothing. Mostly. Regardless of your PCs skills, encumberance, etc. You just need to understand the mechanics with the ATs and the travel map in doing so."

If PCs want to hunt for random encounters, let the PCs go to the encounters, and let travelers on main roads travel safely. "No monsters IC" -safely. Not "long as you know the OoC mechanism of fleeing, and don't get caught up in a AT hickup, lag, etc" -safely.

Even with roads really safe, I feel traveling them alone is more an immersion breaking action than taking an assumed caravan/patrol. Unless your lowbie is ICly stupid and/or suicidial, why would he travel alone instead of with NPCs along the main highways with ample traffic? Only because this is a game and those Argent Legion NPCs don't travel on the engine.

[Keryn]

If the main roads really are supposed to be safe, then there is the rather obvious alternative to really and truly make them safe. No (hostile) random encounters. None. Not "Hostile random encounters where you can turn around, flee, and then keep going as if nothing. Mostly. Regardless of your PCs skills, encumberance, etc. You just need to understand the mechanics with the ATs and the travel map in doing so."

If PCs want to hunt for random encounters, let the PCs go to the encounters, and let travelers on main roads travel safely. "No monsters IC" -safely. Not "long as you know the OoC mechanism of fleeing, and don't get caught up in a AT hickup, lag, etc" -safely.

Even with roads really safe, I feel traveling them alone is more an immersion breaking action than taking an assumed caravan/patrol. Unless your lowbie is ICly stupid and/or suicidial, why would he travel alone instead of with NPCs along the main highways with ample traffic? Only because this is a game and those Argent Legion NPCs don't travel on the engine.

Once again +1 for t-Ice...

We are so worried with what we call immersion and forget why we play... For fun. Its -not- fun to never be able to meet people in a world where we already have few players to begin with and we make it hard to meet the other few that actually log in. Its not immersion breaking to hit an AT and ignore that moment, its a pain to want to RP and have fun and play and watch a map for god knows how long... We need consistency but if we dont draw a line between what is acceptable and what actually ruins the gaming experience then it stops being fun and attractive to play.

I agree fully open travel form one place to the other of the server back and forth would be ridiculous but i think a compromise would just help ALFA move forward.

As I see it when i log in, send a message to gribo and Im in RM, and he says ok I'm at the Golden Oak... I think not again... So I hit the overlandmap.. lose gaming time, lose RP opportunities, gain nothing with it.. its certainly not fun, and nothing to add to my experience is ALFA other then.. a waste of time really.

On other hand if i could fo this one travel with an AT system... i'd be able to join up and Rp for a while, and then decide what to do.

If we add to this equation that some people log in with limited time like 1 hour... or 1 hour and a half, losing those 15 minutes, is a big deal.

[Veilan]

and those Argent Legion NPCs don't travel on the engine.

Actually, they do.

[t-ice]

and those Argent Legion NPCs don't travel on the engine.

Actually, they do.

Then please tell me how my lvl1 PC can hitch a ride with them between Rivermoot and Silverymoon?

[Veilan]

You must be lucky enough to catch one spawning from the start, then tag along. You can also get them as random encounters, along with other non-hostile options.

But yeah, it's not a reliable option for travel, unless you take a PC member.

[Blindhamsterman]

and you can't follow them between areas now... or at least you couldn't last I saw... or does the follow command allow for that? if so, then how about we set those to happen more often and just have players follow them?

[Ithildur]

and those Argent Legion NPCs don't travel on the engine.

Actually, they do.

Then please tell me how my lvl1 PC can hitch a ride with them between Rivermoot and Silverymoon?

I've seen them on occasion during the daytime but it's hit or miss apparently; perhaps if you miss the 8 o clock train you're pretty much screwed for the rest of the day and they've gone ahead without you. Regardless this is far from reliable and mostly irrelevant to the need for a new system that better facilitates PCs getting together. It does nothing for PCs in say, Felbarr/Sundabarr or for folks who cannot schedule their travel plans just so to match the apparently strict and limited patrol schedule. Perhaps it can be tweaked/reworked to be more reliable during the day, but then you're still out of luck at night when an option like riverboat and possibly guarded caravans could be functional. It also does not address the issue of RL time constraints of the player who logs in alone in RM, has an hour to play, and finds all the others in SM. I'm somewhere between keryn's position and AL's; I do think a system that maintains at least SOME immersion/limitations while facilitating folks getting together quicker is ideal, which is why I suggested the double movement rate for overland caravan travel.


As far as the wendover crypt random encounter, I can testify it needs to be looked at. My experience twice has been that you AT into the area and find that the ONLY AT that will get you out of the area is some distance away, and the spawn is standing between you and the AT, or worse right next to that AT. When it's a single skeleton it's not as bad, but when it's a ghast or ghoul on steroids like the one I saw... statistically, it was a minor miracle that my lvl 3 pc survived this unavoidable encounter... although as far as immersion, as T-Ice pointed out it was arguably more realistic than most random encounters where you can clank up to the spawns and check them out without being detected, then choose to walk away leisurely without engaging them... which incidentally I was told by someone that it is legal but 'frowned upon' whatever that means... some misunderstanding/miscommunication going on here, but aside from that, a creative solution does not need to come down to to 'screw immersion' vs 'screw playability'. We can and should aim for both.

[Blindhamsterman]

Side note, just tested following a patrol from HH intention being to get to RM. Auto Follow stops working when they hit the AT. So that's not much use

my suggestion for this would be have the Boatman (or caravanner) AT you to either the hold or a travel area with no ATs respectively. Then after 5 RL mins AT you to the destination.

Keeps immersion to a reasonable extent and allows for a safe (but possibly costly) Travel Option.

Id only allow the use of these once per IG day, same as resting. 24 RL hours is too much IMO